Episode | February 7, 2024

Transcript for Matt Redman and Matt Maher’s the Walk Podcast

‹ Return to Episode

Matt Maher: I heard a quote yesterday and I, I wish I knew who said it, but it was, I was, uh, writing with, uh, A guy named Dee Wilson, who’s a fantastic songwriter, worship leader at New Life Church in Colorado. And he had recently heard this quote, um, that basically said, Art is the way that we decorate the space around us, and music is the way that we decorate time.

Joshua Swanson: Welcome to this special episode of The Walk. I’m Joshua Swanson, your host, and we have the privilege of exploring a truly remarkable project that bridges the past with the present in worship music. Joining us are two pillars of contemporary worship, Matt Maher and Matt Redman, who’ve come together to celebrate and reimagine one of the most beloved hymns in Christian history.

How Great Thou Art. This year marks the 75th anniversary of this powerful hymn, and our guests have played a pivotal role in creating a new work titled How Great Thou Art Until That Day.

Before we dive into the rich history and the collaborative journey behind this project, let’s just take a quick moment to appreciate the sheer magnitude of How Great Thou Art’s influence. With over 1, 600 recordings and billions of streams, this hymn has touched hearts and souls across generations and geographies, truly exemplifying the universal language of worship.

As we embark on this conversation, we’ll explore not only the creative process behind this new rendition, but also the incredible story of how this hymn continues to bless people, not only as a song, but as a fundraiser.

But before we dive in, I wanted to quickly thank our partners who, without which, this podcast wouldn’t exist. First, Planning Center. It’s a set of software tools to help you organize, coordinate, and communicate with your church teams. They know how to connect with your congregation, so if you’re responsible for herding cats, I mean, uh, managing a church team, check them out at planningcenter.

com. I also want to thank the Worship Leader Institute. We are launching a new set of community groups and this is really the best way to connect with other worship leaders, mentor and be mentored, grow in your craft and in your faith. So head to worshipleaderinstitute. com to find out more about the bi monthly community groups.

Okay, without further ado, let’s welcome Matt Marr and Matt Redman to the podcast.

Matt Maher: The CDC called and they wanted a blood sample.

Joshua Swanson: You did put your social security number in, right? Yeah,

Matt Maher: yeah, yeah, yeah,

Joshua Swanson: yeah, yeah. That’s the only way really to get into this interview. Great. It’s pretty casual, but what a special opportunity.

So, uh, for those of you listening, this is Joshua from Worship Leader Mag. I’ve got Matt Redman with me and Matt Marr. Privileged to have you guys hanging with us, uh, to talk about a really special project, How Great Thou Art, the 75th anniversary of this, uh, international hymn and popular song, we could even call it based on all of the different artists that have recorded it throughout the years.

I think it’s up to 1600 recordings now. of How Great Thou Art, which is just outstanding, did some research on the streams and we’re in the billions of streams on the song at this point. So it’s just incredible. Uh, the first question is before I get into the song, like I, you two have a really long history, 12, 15 years of friendship.

What, where, how did you two come together? Like Here For You was like 12 years ago and Were you, were you hanging before that? What, what brought you two together just as friends?

Matt Redman: I’m trying to think when the first time we met, but it probably something through passion or worship together.

Matt Maher: I think it was worship together.

I think it, I think it was a, uh, I think we had dinner at, uh, in Nashville. But we were, we were, yeah, we were both songwriters, you know, uh, working with Kingsway and with Worship together.

Matt Redman: Yeah. And then down through the years, we’ve had done a lot of life together, the songwriting. Some events together, we did a little couple of nights in Ireland, which were one of my favorite things we ever did together.

That, that little club or whatever it was in Dublin was pretty special. Yeah, it was. We’ve had a lot, a lot of lovely moments. And you mentioned here for you, I remember Matt flew in and was sitting in Tomlin’s house. And, and, um, I think it was me, you and Jesse Reeves maybe. And he’s like, Hey, um, I don’t have a whole lot, but on the plane, I just was hearing.

What do we want to say to God in this moment? And we want to say, we’re here for you. Uh, and so here for you was, was kind of born in that moment, which is kind of cool. God, I still lead that now and love it. I love how that song kind of sets the table. You know, if it tells everyone what this is about and what we’re doing, you don’t have to say it because the song says it.

Well, as, uh,

Joshua Swanson: it’s fun, obviously, to talk about your history together as friends, as artists, and all the collaborations, but really, the reason I bring that up is, it fascinates me, because you guys go back, you know, probably 20 years, and this song goes back 75 years, and that’s really the thing that I’m trying to uncover in all of this, is like, You know, what on earth is it about a song that, that is written in the middle of nowhere with the purest of hearts, just this missionary Stuart Heine, and we’ll get into some of his story in a second, but what is it do you think about this song or a song in general that can last 75 years and be recorded 1600 times and resonate with so many people?

Solve the mystery.

Matt Redman: Well, Matt, Matt, you go first.

Matt Maher: Okay. Uh, okay, great. Uh, I mean, I’ll take a swing. Uh, I, I heard a quote yesterday and I, I wish I knew who said it, but it was, I was, uh, writing with a guy named Dee Wilson, who’s a fantastic songwriter, worship leader at New Life Church in Colorado. And he had recently heard this quote, um, that basically said, art is the way we decorate the space around us.

And music is the way that we decorate time. And so, and so what I would say is that I think there are some songs. That people write to decorate a specific moment in time and they, they inadvertently, you don’t know when you’re writing a song if it’s going to be the kind of song that other people, that it decorates the time of other people’s lives.

And, and in some ways, I think with worship, and I think with these songs that are truly just about God and who he is. they could, like you’re decorating eternity. So that was just a crazy thought. Um, but I think that that’s what it is. I think some songs decorate a specific moment in time and it’s really relatable to people.

But I think with worship music, it’s decorating the halls of heaven. Love that. How do you

Matt Redman: follow that? I shouldn’t have let you go first because that’s way too profound. Wherever I follow that with.

Lesson learned. I do love this. I’ve set myself up to fail. No, I do love, we were talking about this. I do love songs that have, like, tell you a bit of God’s timeline, if you like. And so the God of yesterday, today, and forever. And I like that the song, we get to creation, we get to the cross, but also, we get to look forward to the future, like, Christ is going to come again.

And that’s such an essential ingredient. in our, in our worship. So, I think there’s so many reasons this song has connected on such a deep level and has been carried down through the years in such a special way. But I think the fact it has some substance to it, and then it has this opportunity for you to pour out your heart in, in, in, uh, response to God’s story is, It’s a huge

Joshua Swanson: part of it.

Okay, so that’s interesting. So what was your Well, I’ll start with Matt Redman because this, uh, Stuart comes from your country, your neck of the woods. What, what was your first interaction with Stuart Hine, or did you ever meet him? Did you ever Did you know the story? Did you know that he was your neighbor?

Any, anything? Any

Matt Redman: connection there? All I knew was you weren’t allowed to mess with this him. You know, cause I had so many friends who’d be like, yeah, I tried to write an extra bit. I tried to do this. And, you know, actually this hymn is, has a publisher still, and they don’t allow that. And so I think almost every occasion you don’t, you don’t get to do that.

So that’s kind of all I knew. And, and I love the hymn. I think it would have been one of the very first hymns. Um, probably cause it doesn’t have as many chords as a lot of him. So that, that, you know, I think when I was starting out on guitar, that would be one reason I, uh, I ran with this one a lot. Um, and I think what happened was, um, Phil Luce.

Les Moer, uh, Phil Lu is involved with the Stuart he trust and Les Moer. If you don’t know him, you don’t know anyone. Les Moer like shows up in every setting international for the last, yeah, few decades, but they, they reached out and said, Hey, um, the Stuart, he trust is come up seven fifth year. Um, they were like a, a new version of this hymn with an extra section, particularly because what a lot of people don’t know is that the, the words that we sing were all written in Ukraine, in the, in the hills of the Ukraine, uh, of Ukraine by a British missionary.

Um, and I knew a bit of this story before, I knew a bit of the backstory before that bit, and I knew that part, but I didn’t know the Ukraine part. Well, I, I definitely wasn’t, um, mindful of that. So. It felt like, uh, a lovely, uh, kind of challenge, really. But felt a bit of trepidation over the whole thing.

Like, this is a very well loved hymn. You know, should we really be messing with this? But decided, yeah, I’d love to take on that, that challenge. And, um, and Matt was it, Matt Maher? It was in the mix pretty early too. The thing about Matt is he’s like a, he’s like an archaeologist songwriter or something.

Like once he starts digging, man, he gets going. He’s, he’s like, so he went way deeper into the story then. That I did. And I learned a lot of what I learned through him. So I’m not, I mean, you know, I’m not making any kind of dinosaur analogy here or anything. I was just saying, you’d like to

Joshua Swanson: noted. We’re going to write that down.

Matt Maher: Matt

Joshua Swanson: Marr is not a dinosaur. Okay, good. We’re going to take a quick break and we’ll be right back with more from Matt and Matt.

Well, what does that, what does that feel like, Matt, to get a phone call about a 75 year old him that is beloved around the world and. Matt Redman to say, Hey, let’s work on this.

Matt Maher: Yeah. I mean, I was, so my first sort of, uh, intersection with the whole thing was in England at big church day out. So I was there, uh, at the festival and sort of next to the main stage, there’s a, there’s a lot of sort of smaller, different kind of stages and.

Uh, I love big church day out. They, Tim Jeps had a real heart for just gathering all the different denominations. You know, it’s all the different tribes as he likes to call it together. And so I remember there’s this sort of side, sort of like, um, gathering space next to the main stage where like speakers or artists, you know, could kind of run in and grab a coffee, grab a tea.

Uh, it is England after all. Uh, and, and so. I’m, I’m, I’m there to grab a quick coffee and I run into Les and, and I’ve learned now if Les starts talking to you about something and there’s that look in his eye. You should just be prepared. You’re signing up for something. And so he just said, Hey, Matt, uh, Matt’s written a new section for how great thou art.

And so I was sort of processing that of, wow, I know I have a friend who’s still alive. Who’s now part of the story of a song that’s way older. And, um, and then he said, you know, Hey, we’re going to try to get a bunch of people to sing on a recording. Could, could you maybe record the vocals at your studio?

And I just said, you know, for me, it, it, the, it was less about the song and it just, it is more just about like, Matt’s my friend. He’s gotten to be part of something really cool. Do you want to help out? Do you want to help your friend out? And so to me, it was just that simple of like, Oh yeah, yeah, of course.

I’d love to help out any way I could. And then I came home and I ended up having a conversation with a guy who works for a publishing company in Sweden. And just sort of learned about the roots, uh, of the song and how there’s this Swedish folk melody that kind of inspired, uh, Stuart Heine, which is just beautiful.

And so just learning about the arc of the song and then I was like, well, how did it get? And so then I, like Matt said, I am sort of like a Google archeologist and I just went looking up the story and how, you know, it interwoven with the story is, is the story of missionary work. Of people sort of discovering God in the midst of just being faithful to him and how Stuart was inspired by A poem and he was also inspired by the testimony of other believers in the midst of conflict after the Second World War as people fleeing Ukraine They were fleeing the Soviet Union And the expansion of communism.

And so, so much of that story is interwoven into the story of this hymn. And, and by that point, I’d been talking to Phil Luce who works with the trust and just said, you got to tell this whole story, it’s just a really compelling story and especially on the 75th anniversary to mark the time and how the song got heard by the Billy Graham crusades and then Elvis heard it and he records it in Nashville and his first.

Grammy is his recording of this song. So it just felt like, what if there’s an opportunity to kind of mark that, that 75th anniversary in a more unique way.

Joshua Swanson: Yeah, absolutely. What a, what a special story. I think that’s the thing that resonates with me the most is understanding the history is, it’s so pure.

It is truly a missionary that had no intention of seeing his song travel across the globe, and then the history of the song and how it traveled across the globe, and like you said, ended up in the hands of George Beverly Shea and Billy Graham. Which put it, you know, gave it a megaphone is just, it’s interesting the way the Lord just decides a certain song is for the nations.

So outside of the mechanics of the song, uh, it’s an enduring classic dive into the lyrics and the words for me, you know? Um, yeah. Well, I, again, I guess I’ll start with Matt Redmond because of, uh, you know, the lyrics that you added to this song, where did you even begin?

Matt Redman: Yeah,

Joshua Swanson: so fasting in prayer, what they had

Matt Redman: Well, , what happened was, um. I think when they reached out to me, I was on a songwriting camp, um, and there was, so like, I don’t know, 15 other songwriters there, and I thought immediately, I’m, you know, I need some help with this, um, and I, and Mitch Wong was in the room, and Mitch has such, such a wonderful gift, and, Especially melodically.

And I also knew that it’s not even going to be a conversation with him or with his label integrity, you know, is for all the proceeds to go, you know, just to write for free kind of thing. So I said to him, Hey, when everyone else goes home tonight, um, why don’t me and you stay and we’ll have a go at this hymn thing.

Um, and I already had some thoughts, but to be totally honest, originally the trust, Stuart Iron Trust said to me, um, but it can’t be another verse. And so, but, but I was kept going around it and around it and around it. I thought all I’m getting is, uh, thoughts that are verse like, so, um. What I thought is what about if it’s like a heightened melodic verse, so we’ll take that last original verse, you know of When Christ shall come a shout of acclamation and and it starts getting you into the idea of heaven I thought what if we continue the thought from there?

So until that day when heaven bid us welcome and as we walk this broken warring world Your kingdom come, deliver us from evil, uh, and we’ll proclaim our God how great you are, with hope we’ll sing, our God how great you are. And it’s interesting, just going into it, I thought, I want the word war in there, like, I know it’s not really like your kind of Sunday morning worship song vibe usually, but it felt like an important word to have in there.

So I had this idea of this, as we walk this broken, warring world, and then I realized, Oh, you know what scans perfectly? Um, your kingdom come, deliver us from evil. So that was a great moment thinking, Oh, perfect. Um, so the idea was really, let’s not have an escapist moment, because that’s not good in worship, where we ignore what’s going on in the world around us.

Uh, you know, let’s embrace that reality. We are living in a broken, warring world, and we can see that in a very particular way here. But, so let’s, let’s face that head on, and then let’s sing with hope and faith over that. So that was the kind of concept. And when we turned it in, I said, look, apologies. I know you say you didn’t want another verse, but this is kind of a verse and it’s kind of not and, uh, they, they liked it.

So that was a good moment.

Joshua Swanson: That’s great. So one of my favorite quotes about this song is Billy Graham’s. He says about how great thou art. It glorified God. It turned a Christian’s eyes toward God rather than upon himself. Uh, Matt Marr, you are writing a lot of songs, obviously, uh, daily. And, uh, I think recently you and I.

when we were at the recording, talked about this shift that’s been happening where we’re going less vertical and a little bit more horizontal, a little bit more declarative about who God is. So I think it’s really interesting the timing of How Great Thou Art kind of coming back around in this season where we’re seeing that people just want to write songs about, and people just want to be reminded of who God is.

Would you, would you agree with that? Would you want to expand on that thought? Yeah, I mean,

Matt Maher: I think to me the pendulum, it’s like, you know, You, you’ve been, I, I’ve been sort of in these kind of spaces for long enough to start to kind of realize, uh, a pattern in the sense that the pendulum does seem to kind of swing.

And, and I think the, the goal, you know, uh, is as the church embraces, uh, more of a vision for being a missional church in the sense that like we’re, we’re always being sent out into the world to proclaim the gospel, but we’re on a journey. Towards his kingdom being built and established, you know what I mean?

And the kingdom of God, the people of God. You know, we’re, we’re on, we’ll never be finished until fully, until we get to heaven, but we’re still in sort of this, this, um, this we’re still on this kind of journey of faith. And so I think in worship, one of the things that would be great to see is maybe. Less of a pendulum swing and more of a bout of a bo a both and, mm.

And uh, but I do think that, um, you know, like I look around and I, you like, I’ll see like, you know, like a, a mutual friend of mine and Matt’s sound like holy forever. Why does that song resonate so much with people? And it’s like, because I think at the end of the day, most people are aware of their own humanity and how rough life is.

And when you’re going to church, you’re really coming with a hope to encounter something entirely other and transcended. And, and bigger than you, we, you know, I don’t think anybody wants to stare at their own baggage all day long. Um, and so I do think that songs become a way to kind of lift your eyes.

And so at the same time, I think we do need music that, that maybe helps us reflect on what does it mean for us to be the body of Christ. So I, I think you need both and I definitely, but I do think that these songs about who God is and how great he is and how loving he is and how merciful he is just songs about him.

We always need a healthy balance of those. Like it, it, it’s really, really important because it’s. You know, it has, I’ve heard Matt say this, the throne sets the tone. It, a big part about worship is declaring and remembering who he is.

Joshua Swanson: What does it mean for us as? Uh, stewards of the modern worship movement to continue to go back to some of these classic hymns.

Is there like a liturgical element to it? Is there, is the history important? Like why do we keep going back? Why, why do, you know, there’s that core hymnal, you know, that continues that we keep going back to. Any kind of open question for either of you? Thoughts on that? Yeah. I mean,

Matt Redman: I love how it, it just reminds us we’re not part of this 2024 club.

You know, there’s all sorts of organizations and clubs and different things you can be part of. This is not that. This is the church of God. We’ve got amazing heritage that stretches back so, so far. And to me, it’s actually amazing. You can take some of these hymns that are even hundreds of years old, and somehow they’re still relevant and they resonate.

Now, that doesn’t really make sense in a lot of ways, you know, in terms of how fast culture moves, moves on and different things like that. I think a lot of it is to do because you’re seeing truth and if you sing truth and present truth in a beautiful and poetic way, it’s going to land well and it can transcend, um, you know, time periods.

And I mean, it still astonishes me, obviously the classic example is the Psalms. It’s astonishing that we can sing songs at 3000 years old. And somehow they resonate with us and they help us put into words things we want to put into words that that doesn’t make any sense. That’s 3000 years. I mean, imagine how different life was in every conceivable way.

And yet the songs find their ways into our hearts onto our lips and they and they work. And so. I think that’s the thing about hymns. I remember when I was first starting out as a worship leader, I was in my mid teens and my vicar, who would be the pastor, you know, in the Anglican church in England, he, he’s also, yeah, I love your new songs, but please keep bringing the old, he says, there’s some verse somewhere in the old.

in the New Testament about a wise steward brings out the old and new treasures from the storehouse. And he would always throw that at me and say, Hey, this is great. You keep pushing forward, but you keep looking back as well. You have to keep bringing us these hymns. And he encouraged me to learn some and bring them.

And some days I didn’t do it with the most willing spirit, joyful heart I should have. Sometimes it’s like, Oh, you know, like, um, but actually I was so grateful. Because he was just telling me, there’s a heritage here, there’s a deep well here. And down through the years, as well as leading hymns. You know, I think, uh, and reminding people of that heritage and family history we have actually as a songwriter after the Bible, I’d say the hymn writers are the thing that helped me the most.

I don’t know if Matt agrees, but for me, sometimes you can actually steal their lyrics and that’s awesome. But other times just get inspired by their approach or their angle onto the cross or, um, or just the breadth of what they’re writing about.

Matt Maher: Yeah. I mean, I would say even. Like I being a Catholic, I love liturgy and I’ve come to understand more and more that liturgical prayers were often are often supposed to be sung.

So I think singing is an inherent part of what we’re supposed to do when we worship God. And so I think that hymns. Uh, are a way in which, you know, I say the work of the liturgy means, you know, work of the people. And it’s like the work of the church is to declare the work of God and to remember the work of God.

So it, it, it’s a very, very unique calling, but it, in some ways it’s us remembering the work he’s done, uh, you know, as we consider what we’re called to do as his hands and feet. But that, you know, what we’re called to do in the world is never supposed to be, I think, a replacement of that aspect, you know, of remembering and celebrating what he alone can do and has done.


Joshua Swanson: I think you’ve got a new podcast that you should start, Matt Marr, the archaeologist of worship.

Matt Maher: Yeah. Worship archeology.

Joshua Swanson: Redmond’s comment about you as an archeologist was like, that’s resonating with me right now. Yeah. I love that. Okay. Another question. Uh, you did bring up the war earlier. Uh, uh, Matt Redmond brought up the war and man, you know, there’s so much war around this song.

You know, when you understand the history, Stuart went to world war one and actually fought and some of his. Experiences in the trenches are harrowing, but Holy Spirit filled at the same time. He wrote the song just before World War II, was kicked out of the country, and then served in the UK in internment camps where he wrote the fourth verse.

War is throughout. And then, so it’s very interesting to me, uh, Redmond, that you Wanted to bring the word war into this new bridge and obviously now we’re experiencing another war in Israel And you’ve written a lot about songs of lament for us at worship leader mag Would you categorize this as a song of lament and then a follow up question open to the floor would be what is our role?

as the, the Levites, the stewards of the temple, the psalmists of the church in these times of war?

Matt Redman: That’s a great question. Um, you know, I think it’s interesting. So I wouldn’t say this is a song of lament, but when you talk about all the soil that this was planted in out of, you know, into, I guess the, the It’s pretty, uh, pretty sure that’s part of its reason why it does resonate so, so well. And I think those songs, yeah, they’re just so, so important, aren’t they?

Because, um, for one thing, you know, they give us a chance to be real with God and follow in that pattern of the psalmist. But I also think when we sing our songs of lament, they also give a lovely window onto the heart of God. You know, they’re, they are, I just like it. We, it’s like, we take the walls down a bit and we don’t, and we, you know, sometimes the church is in danger of trying to pretend it’s perfect to everyone.

And clearly we’re not. And I kind of like that disarming thing that happens when we sing lament. It just brings all the walls down and reminds us we’re all in the same boat here. We’ve all got tough things we’re facing, and we’re Christians, but we haven’t got it all together. And we definitely haven’t had all our problems solved just because we came to Christ.

Um, and so, yeah, for me, I’m always a fan of that approach, because I, I think it’s very biblical to sing like that, but it’s also very helpful, um, for people around us.

Joshua Swanson: So, last question, as the songwriters Uh, the church right now, you guys have both written songs that have gone far and wide. Uh, if you guys, uh, what, what would be your, how great thou art?

What’s the song that you’ve written that you hope 75 years from now people will still be singing? Uh, not necessarily because of anything that you did, but because of the message and because of why you

Matt Redman: think it’s so important. Wow. That’s a big question. This

Matt Maher: is a big question. Well,

Joshua Swanson: you guys have written a lot of songs, so.

There’s that too, but I mean, think about the enduring legacy of, of this song, you know, it’s really special. It

Matt Redman: goes way beyond glory. It’s my new single, right?

Matt Maher: This is where you promote your new song,

Joshua Swanson: that’s

Matt Maher: right. Oh my goodness.

Joshua Swanson: I was teeing it up for you

Matt Redman: there, Matt. Yeah, I mean, honestly, obviously for me, this song that’s had the most stories come back from it and seems to have the furthest reach around the globe would be Ten Thousand Reasons.

If any, if any of them have a chance of being sung, certainly Five Years, probably that one. Um, I mean, Matt sung Lord I Need You. With the Pope and 2 million people or 2 to 3 million people. I don’t know how many people were there on Copacabana beach. So, uh, that, that, that’s, uh, that’s definitely has to have a nomination.

Matt Maher: Yeah. I mean, I would, yeah, I would definitely probably say that song, or I would say something like, I hope I haven’t written it yet, but that’s probably my flesh or my ego talking because as a songwriter, you, you never want to feel like. You’ve made your contribution, you know what I mean? Uh, um, so I mean, yeah, yeah, it, it, it, it, as in terms of artistic expression, it’s, it’s that thing of going like you, you, you keep digging and you keep keeping an archeologist, but you’re in, you know, but it, it’s in some ways that the, the great legacy of this song was, uh, is that it, Stuart Hine is in heaven.

And, and, and, and that’s, that’s that legacy. And he didn’t, he didn’t establish the trust and he didn’t do what he did because he was trying to do a legacy. He just did it because he was trying to be faithful to God. And so that’s

Matt Redman: chasing significance is always a good plan.

Matt Maher: Yeah, really, really is. So I, you know, I think it, in some ways.

Um, you know, you, you, you, with, when you’re making stuff, you’d never really have any control over the outcome. So, um,

Matt Redman: And it’d be interesting to see if, if people pick up this new version, I mean, you know, will they just stick with the old version? We would love if, if worship leaders connect to this and they like the new section and the new arrangement.

Cause honestly, part of it’s the new section, but also there’s a. You know, the arrangement wise, I love where it landed. Matt actually brought that motif that we start with and the time signature idea. And honestly, I love, I’ve been leading it and I love leading this version. And so, you know, just to worship leaders out there, obviously you’re not going to have.

Um, Chris Tomlin, Hilary Scott, Taya, Naomi Reign, Mitch Wong, Matt Maher, you know, and the list goes on singing along with you, but, um, but honestly, I’ve led the work, the version without all those guys and it still works. So I’d love to, and this is kind of a cool, you know, um, Two for one worship vibe thing because you’re going to sing it to God in your worship and in your congregation.

But, but every time you lead this song or you listen to it or stream it or buy it, all, all that, all the funds are going to go to, uh, humanitarian aid in Ukraine and Eastern Europe. So you’re on a double win there singing this one. Absolutely.

Joshua Swanson: Yeah. I, and I just want to clarify that too for our listeners.

So Matt and Mitch donated. Their publishing rights to the trust integrity, who admins the song and capital, who admins the song have donated the majority of their admin fees. Almost all, I think to the trust. Uh, so it might even cost them money. And then, CCLI has donated all of their fees. And so, this truly is a giant fundraiser.

Uh, and an incredible opportunity for us to lead a song that brings us all into the throne room, but also, um, To Matt’s point, you know, supports people in need right now that are in war torn countries like the Ukraine, so it’s a pretty incredible story. Well, thank you guys for hanging with us and talking about, uh, this song and a little bit about songwriting and your thoughts on the church and all of that.

Uh, it’s an honor and a privilege to sit with you and, uh, thanks for putting this project together for the church. I think it’s really special. Absolute,

Matt Redman: uh, pleasure. Great to

Matt Maher: talk to you. Yeah, thanks so much.

Joshua Swanson: Thank you Matt and Matt for spending time with us. You can hear their new version of How Great Thou Art until that day on worshipleader.

com. If you haven’t done so already, it would really mean a lot to us if you would subscribe to our podcast and leave us a review. All right, until next time, I want to thank the team at Life Audio for their partnership. If you go to lifeaudio. com, you’ll find a collection of faith centered podcasts about health and wellness, parenting, current cultural events, Bible teachings, devotionals, and more.

And we are very honored to be a part of the life audio family. So check them out at life audio. com. I’m Joshua Swanson. Thanks for listening.