Joshua Swanson: Welcome to The Walk; a devotionals podcast led by worship leaders. In this episode, Matt Maher tells a story about a time that he would have literally paid money to fall into a sinkhole. Here we go.
Matt Maher: I have a funny story of when I realized that I had a lot of growing up to do in my life. I think, I think everyone goes through moments where you, uh, are exposed to a part of you that you did not realize was as big of a part of you, as you thought. It was 1996. I was playing keyboards in a worship team at my church and we were doing a training conference and it was a new church that I’ve been going to for six months. And, uh, I was studying music in college. I was three years into a music degree. I was, um, you know, basically about to start, uh, finishing my degree in jazz on the piano and I was pretty confident in my ability and was playing secondary keyboards.
And if I’m honest, I was a little bit, um; I just thought I was better than the piano player and, uh, I had better skills and, um, but nevertheless here I was playing a chord keyboard, standing up like an eighties rockstar. Playing a keyboard and we’re demonstrating sort of like how to play liturgical music. So, how do you know lead worship in a liturgical context and so we’re going through all the different parts of liturgy and we’re talking about, you know, using a band and, and so then, um, you know, one of the guys who, uh, uh, was the guy that I was working under said, uh, oh, I, I need to introduce the band.
And so he starts going around and he starts introducing all the band and he is like, and here’s, this is so and so, and he plays the drums and then this is so and so he’s a guitar player and so, and so, and he gets through the whole band and he completely forgot about me. And I was just sort of standing there and everyone else is looking at this guy and they’re like, you, Matt, you forgot, you forgot Matt. And he’s like, oh, oh, how silly of me? I, I, I forgot; this is the, our newest, uh, this is the newest, uh, person. He’s the new member on staff. We’re really excited, uh, to have him here, uh, part-time on staff. Uh, this is, uh, this is Matt. This is Matt Maher and I felt so small in that moment.
If I had an inner child, that inner child was standing in the rain without a raincoat. Holding, uh, a balloon that was deflated and was slowly just sinking to the ground. And if there was a sinkhole that would’ve opened in that moment and swallowed me hole, I would’ve gladly welcomed it. I would’ve paid, I would’ve paid, I would’ve taken my, my tuition scholarship for being a jazz major and I would’ve cashed it in for a sinkhole that would’ve swallowed me up for that moment with the sheer amount of shame I felt. And I felt shame because I felt ashamed at how I felt. I felt ashamed at the fact that it bothered me so much that this person forgot about me, that I was an afterthought. And I just thought this shouldn’t matter that much.
I know in my head what it means to be a servant. I know on paper, what it means to be a servant, like, but, but why, why am I having such a hard time with it? And it made me realize that I needed a mentor, that I needed to be mentored. I need to get to a point in my life where maybe this doesn’t matter as much to me.
And I look back on that moment now as a real pivotal, small moment that most people will probably not even know that oh, that kid’s, uh, trajectory of his life was shaped by that moment, but for me it was. And I’ve learned to be incredibly grateful for it because it was really the beginning of a journey where that person who actually forgot about me became one of the most influential, positive people in my life who is really a big brother and I’m grateful for him so much and his willingness to journey with me in faith.
Joshua Swanson: In the second half of this episode, Matt explains that for some leaders being mentored can mean being willing to identify some of your blind spots. For those who mentor, it can also mean laying down your vision for your future, laying down your call, and even laying down your life for another leader.
Some of you may have already heard that we are launching an online Institute called the Worship Leader Institute, and here to tell us a bit more about it are some of our team members; including our Institute Director, Robb Redman.
Barrie Buckner: What’s up y’all this is Barrie Buckner again, head of strategic partnerships here at Worship Leader Magazine and Authentic Media. I’m excited to share with you an interview with the masterminds behind the Worship Leader Institute, our new platform launching this fall. First up, I asked the president of WLM, Lexi Fromm why she and the team decided to create WLI in the first place.
Lexi Fromm: The Worship Leader Institute was an idea from my father and the idea started well beyond my time of beginning at Worship Leader, but it was the last thing that we worked on together before he went to heaven and we wanted to create a place for our subscribers to gather beyond just a one time meeting at the conference and a place where they could continue learning together.
Barrie Buckner: Next, I spoke to the Associate Director of the Institute, Jason Harris, about the cost of the program. Our subscription starts at just $14.99 a month.
Jason Harris: You know, the heart of the Worship Leader Institute is for the local church and for worship leaders desiring to strengthen their leadership and their ministry. And so with that in mind, our goal was to build a program that includes workshops and classes from experienced church leaders. That’s both affordable and accessible to churches and leaders of any size and budget. And, uh, we believe affordability and accessibility are the keys to building up worship leaders and ministry volunteers, wherever and however they might be called.
Barrie Buckner: And finally, I had the honor of speaking with Robb Redman, who serves as the Director of the Institute about the teachers and the topics that we cover.
Robb Redman: The course designers and teachers at the Worship Leader Institute are carefully chosen not only for their practical experience, but also for their ability to think biblically and theologically about what they do and why they do it and also they have the ability to communicate effectively what they, uh, their experience and their knowledge for the benefit of others.
So, these reflective practitioners really are the core of the Worship Leader Institute. We’re delighted to have a cadre of seasoned practitioners who are willing to work alongside us to develop the best courses we can offer.
Barrie Buckner: If you want to go beyond the performance and give back to the heart of worship by learning from some of the best minds in worship, visit worshipleaderinstitute.com. That’s www.worshipleaderinstitute.com.
Joshua Swanson: One more note regarding the Institute; we have a robust coaching program headed by Joe Horness, who comes with decades of experience leading teams and worship programs at places like Willow Creek. We’ll hear from Joe on the mentorship and coaching aspect of our Institute in an upcoming episode.
Okay. back to Matt.
Matt Maher: So I was talking about how, you know, I went through this kind of embarrassing moment in front of a bunch of strangers at a conference. Feeling kind of forgotten and realizing it kind of exposed a bit of a core wound of like needing, wanting to be seen and affirmed, but really what it exposed was the need to be mentored.
And when you start talking about the idea of people in ministry needing to be mentored one of the stories that fascinates me is the story of Moses and Joshua. And I think it actually has an application for both older people in ministry and younger people in ministry.
So I remember it was 2004. I was leading worship on a youth retreat and I was up late one night outside reading my Bible. Now, before you think I’m really holy, I was smoking a cigarette while I was doing it, so full confession, but you know, I’ve, I’ve been quit smoking for almost 20 years now. Um, but, and nevertheless, I’m up late, uh, reading the book of Deuteronomy and smoking a cigarette. And I get to this part at the end of the book of Deuteronomy, which is the death of Mose and it literally, I remember the subheading. It’s not like, it just says like in italics, the death of Moses. So I just thought, oh, I should pay attention. And God leads Moses us up to this, you know, you know, basically up and shows him the promise land. He’s like, there it is. There’s the, there’s the land that you found it. Uh, and now you’re gonna die. You’re not the guy to carry these people to walk with these people into the promise land. Instead I’ve appointed Joshua, Son of Nun.
It was this moment where the Holy Spirit, as I was reading, it was whispering into my ear, pay attention. You need to pay attention to this. This is very, very important as a leader.
I should note that as I was reading this story, it was about seven years after the embarrassing story that I talked about earlier. So I seven years had transpired of living and being mentored and having my ego crushed by being in a local church, pouring myself out and serving people, trying to write songs, writing a lot of bad songs. Having your songs torn apart by deacons who don’t have a music degree and, you know, countless times of wishing, I wrote Heart of Worship, all of it. Um, but this moment was interesting for me because the more I thought on it, what a sense that God was saying was, there are gonna be things in your life that you have a vision for, and possibly even a calling for, but it’s not yours maybe to see to fruition. You’re gonna carry it so far and then I’m gonna point out somebody else that you need to be willing to raise up and say, okay, your job is to take it the next chapter. Cuz a lot of what I see happening in the church right now is people who get raised up to be a leader and get to a certain point and don’t know what’s gonna come next.
And they’ve been mentored, they’ve been raised up, but they don’t know what it’s like to experience this moment. And what I didn’t realize until this chapter in my life of now of seeing new, younger, talented people come up and seeing God open doors for them that I had a vision for, but they didn’t open for me.
As you have two choices, you either praise God for him opening the door for that person, or you become bitter to say, well, I don’t understand why you wouldn’t open it for me. And I never stopped to think about the fact that the people who mentored me when they saw me come along and they saw the things that God doing in my life, that they had a vision for that in their life and I came along and all of a sudden I was doing the things that they wanted to do, but they never complained and they never held it against me, and they never once made me feel bad for the fact that I was getting to do things that maybe they wished they would’ve gotten to do.
And so that’s sort of like one of the last, I think seasons of mentoring, I’m learning as a leader is when you get old, the thing that you realize is the people that mentored you, you can’t be grateful for ’em until you get to a certain point and you realize how much they actually really did kind of lay down to be a mentor.
And I wonder if Joshua did, I wonder if Joshua later in his life was looking back on Moses and going, wow, he really did just let me lead those, like he laid down and died. He didn’t try to object to God say, “well, can’t you keep me alive for a little bit longer? Surely. you’re God. Right?”
So, there’s this element of learning to accept the will of God, because scripture also shows us a really clear example of what happens when a leader tries to hold onto his power for too long in Saul and David and you just admire a young person for their talent, but don’t actually stop to think that maybe they’re being raised up as a leader. In that story, we see what happens with sort of the unwillingness to relinquish authority and power and holding onto it.
So for me, what I’m learning and mentoring is that there comes a willingness as a young person to be mentored. And then there comes a willingness as an older person when it’s time to mentor people to realize that you’ve carried certain things as far as you’re supposed to, and it’s time for someone else.
And you learn to find joy in that. Not so much the doing of, you know, climbing the mountain or building a tower, but in watching someone else do it and celebrating the activity of God in their life as they’re doing it.
So my encouragement, if you’re listening to this and you’re, you’re a young worship leader, frustrated is, um, are you willing to be mentored number one?Are, are you willing to allow the Holy Spirit to identify the blind spots in your character that need to be formed. The places where your ego gets bruised or you don’t feel noticed or seen? And, and then my, my question, if you’re older, is, are you afraid of being replaced? Are you afraid of the young guy who’s more talented than you and all the things, you know, and do you need to grieve and let go of what was so that you can embrace the season of what can be? And trust that in doing that, that God is on the move and he just wants you to be involved in a different way.
Joshua Swanson: Do you have a mentor? Are you mentoring someone? Would you be willing to lay your plans down and allow another person to pick them up and see them to fruition? In our self-focused culture those are not topics we usually discuss, which is why we’re so grateful to Matt for his contribution to our podcast.
Matt is a prolific songwriter and performer. He’s got a new album coming out in October, so be on the lookout for that, but he recently released a single based on the Lord’s prayer that we’ll use to play out our episode.
As always, special thanks to Matt McCarty for producing and editing today’s episode. Jacob Fairclough produced our theme song. The Walk is brought to you by Worship Leader Magazine, which is an Authentic Media brand. I’m Joshua Swanson. Here’s Matt song, The Lord’s Prayer (It’s Yours).
